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| musical chess and chess as art |
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I'm just getting out of the army. And while chess is somewhat popular among the higher ranking soldiers and officers, I encountered an attitude toward concerted efforts made in the royal game's field that frustrated me somewhat. One of my bosses whom I played many times said that "those great chess players, whom the public so reveres as possessing some intellect vastly superior to ours ought to spend their time on more important matters such as the effort to find a cure for cancer" and so on. In several of your interviews, you've made some gestures toward a rejoinder which would make a strong argument for a greater populartity of the game. Do you subscribe to the notion that chess is an art? If so, do you feel that beautifully played chess can make a difference in someone's life, move them and inspire them? Do you agree with Vladmir Kramnik that one requires a (FIDE) rating of about 1700 to really appreciate the game?
thanks!
Rod |
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| Re: musical chess and chess as art |
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When you think about it, chess has a lot in common with art. For one, you have to practice to get better and better at it. Studying the greats can help increase your depth both in art and in chess. You also have the factor of talant which applies to both fields as well. This is where someone has a natural ability to excell at a much quicker rate than most. FInally, I'd like to retort to your boss's remark by saying that chess intellect is all about experience, not the ability to just be smarter than everyone else. This means an intellectual genius can be terrible at chess and vice versa for the chess genius. Some can excell at both, but you can't quantify a chess professional as somebody who could have found the cure to cancer instead of studying chess.
As for Kramnik's remark, I'd only correct it by saying somone around 1700 can start to deeply appreciate art in chess via watching masters play. That is not to say people below that rating cannot appreciate chess. It just means by this level you can understand deep moves but might not actually find them yourself in practice. For example, when I was a 1200, I'd watch masters play and be consfused most of the time as to why they didn't do such and such. I'd be saying, "what the heck?". Now years later, I can watch masters play and be thinking, "Oh nice! Yes! I bet he'll sac the rook here... yep, he did". I'm sure you get the idea of Kramnik's comment this way.
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| Re: musical chess and chess as art |
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Interesting post, Roderick. To be honest, I rather disagree with this general assessment that chessplayers are A)Nerds B)Smarter than everyone. Although it takes quite a strong work ethic to become the very best at any game, working hard does not necessarily mean you are smarter. For instance, Michael Jordan was the best basketball player ever, but he was hardly above average until he played at UNC. In general, I would agree with what Kramnik says. However, you must understand that much of this negativity towards chess is in no small part due to the popular notions that chessplayers are nutcases. Until this perception is changed there will always be people who think its a complete joke. |
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| Re: musical chess and chess as art |
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Hikaru,
Thanks for replying to my post. Yes, I agree. Hard work is an undeniable factor in the success of a performance artist. Average intelligence/talent + hard work should should outperform above average intelligence/talent + laziness. This guy might have thought that the only kind of intelligence is fluid intelligence not crystal intelligence. And, that the general mental skills required to play high level chess (memory, spatial reasoning an visualization) are easily transferred to other areas (specialties really). And while there may be some truth to this argument , it completely dismisses the passion and acheivements of a set of people based on their benign career decision. It may be true, perhaps that the long term impact will be felt mostly within the confines of the chess community. So I boiled it down to: he wouldn't pursue chess. But I won't feel guilty for pursuing a field which I genuinely feel passion for.
On another note. I've been toying with the idea of writing a piano piece of music based on a chess game. I would use leitmotifs for each piece and also use the squares as a construct for the piece. And counter-balance all of the theoretical basis with an aesthetic sense of direction and movement. I enjoy your chess playing and style and thought that one of your games would make a particularly good game to use. This would make my first attempt at writing a piece of music based on a chess game, one of your blitz games. If there is a game that you feel best represents your style, with your permission I'd like to base my piece on that game. I particularly liked your game against Bu with which you finished the recent tournament in Gibraltar.
Thanks! |
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| Re: musical chess and chess as art |
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Hi all
About chess being art, we should first make clear what we mean by the “art” term, there are so many theories about it. Generally speaking we can define art, for the sake of simplicity, as a product a human activity made with the intention of transmitting emotions and ideas. If we stick with this simplified definition I would find rather hard to put chess in the Art shelf, common sense tells me a game of chess doesn’t satisfy these “requirements”… lets be honest, first of all it’s not a human activity J … one normally goes into a chess game with the intention to crush his opponent, rather than to send his frail emotions to glean softly into the humanity’s tiara of spirit and culture.
But if (the strong chess player) Marcel Duchamp’s Fountain is considered a piece of art, I don’t see why chess shouldn’t be. I remember about reading about an art gallery owner who saw a cow gnawing a rusty can on the side road and remarked :“This is a fine piece of contemporary art”.
Regarding the idea about chess transposed in a music piece, it happened before in other domains, two are coming in my mind right now: chemistry - organic synthesis copying the development of a chess position, and a beautiful short story written by Borges, Emma Zunz (here is an article about it, if you’re interested: http://www.themodernword.com/borges/borges_papers_roos.html) where the woman sacrifices herself in the end in order to kill/mate the bad guy, the action of the story is allegedly following a real chess game played in that period and known by Borges. |
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| Re: musical chess and chess as art |
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Thank's for your reply Bogdan Is chess art? This is an interesting debate, although I don't really intend to debate the question here. It seems that chess is closer to being a sport than an art. Competitive elements do exist in many artistic arenas. Michael Jordan's basketball playing was beautiful and graceful, and yet we think of it more as a sport than an art. We could refer to the learning or performance process as an art, say like the art of playing the endgame, or the art of soccer. But to say that it is an art might seem to be stretching it. On the other hand, Jazz wasn't considered an art, nor was it accepted as "art music" by the music establishment for many years. I believe one of the reasons that chessplayers may feel that what they are doing is art, is that, unlike other sports, spectators can play through the game, make the same moves that the original performers made and derive more from the experience. I felt emotions, as a musical artist, which were completely foreign to me after learning chess. I scarcely played some 30 games when I started playing in tournaments last year at 30 years of age. I didn't even know what en passant was, nor that you couldn't castle through check! But, I agree with Kramnik, that chess is highly emotional. I've learned so much about myself. The moves I make under this or that kind of pressure. So, maybe, also, I'm stretching it to say that I'm feeling someone's experience when I go through their game... I forgot to list one other mental skill in one of my former posts which I consider highly vital to playing good chess. Creativity! Of course a good boxer must be creative and so must other sportsmen. All I can really say, I guess, is that I feel something similar to the feeling I get when I play the piano or compose a piece of music when I'm playing chess. What is art? and of course this is another discussion! |
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